Rovers vs Stoke

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doz_magic_man
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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by doz_magic_man » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:53 pm

ethiaa wrote:Hey, if BFS does something different I'll be delighted - maybe he learnt something at Newcastle. The fact he even tries to make them play like Bolton bodes ill. Stick with your rose coloured specs tho, everything will be fine.


Frankly, I'd rather grind out stacks of boring 1-0 victories and finish 5th than play free-flowing football and finish 7th. It's a results business first and foremost, attractive style of play second. I would say that 80% of Hughes's team performances were far from pleasing on the eye, although when things picked up he signalled his intention to play more attractive football.

I will be surprised if Allardyce gets the team playing as negatively as Bolton could play but I was a bit concerned when I read a comment saying something along the lines of; "we need to get 1-0 wins instead of winning by three clear goals". I hope he just meant that we need to be defensively water tight so that when we are in a tight match we don't concede and can hold on for a 1-0.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Rover the Moon » Sun Dec 21, 2008 11:47 pm

On Saturday I was delighted with the result if not the manner of the performance but until we get clear of the drop zone results are all that matter. However........not all teams will come bearing gift like Stoke.

EDIT: And if Jason Roberts could finish what a great striker he'd make. The lad is a fooking lump :numpty;

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Ichi The Killer » Mon Dec 22, 2008 1:13 am

Rover the Moon wrote: And if Jason Roberts could finish what a great striker he'd make.
Bit too late if you ask me.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Rover the Top » Mon Dec 22, 2008 8:22 am

doz_magic_man wrote:I'm glad that Sam has managed to shut the doubters up,
You're taking the piss, surely? Ince won his first game in charge, did that convince you that everything was going to be brilliant under him, too? It'll be ten games or so before anyone can say whether he stands a chance of keeping us up.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Rover the Top » Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:10 am

blackburn35 wrote:
bigpops wrote: it makes me want to :doh: cause u never say posative things
i agree with you most people on this board are super negative.
It's a little absurd to say the person who claims "WE SHALL BE VICTORIOUS" before every game never has anything positive to say. :scratch: And I strongly disagree that most people are super negative. This is generally the most optimistic board I read. But we're not so stupid to ignore that things haven't been going well recently - what positives are there in losing 6 on the trot? I gave my views on Allardyce last week, I'm not going to keep banging on about them. It was nice to win on Saturday, but anyone taking a balanced view will know that 3-0 flattered us. We're still in serious trouble and really need to win the next three games to ease the pressure. There were two things that did please me on Saturday - firstly, our midfield got back and defended for the first time this season. But then my main criticism of Ince's tactics was that we were leaving our back 4 exposed too often, I don't think it needed a genius to sort that out. The other thing was that we left McCarthy up front every time we defended a set piece. Both Ince and Hughes believed in dragging everyone back, I've always thought it's worth leaving someone up as the attacking team will keep at least two players back. And you stand a chance of relieving pressure if your attacker can get the ball, it's not going to come straight back every time. Apart from that, there was little sign of tactical input. Understandable, since Allardyce had two days to work with the team. But it also means there's little we can say about how we'll be playing in 10 games' time.
And blackburn35, you're the one who keeps suggesting everything should be done as it is in American sports. Now that's a very negative view... ;)

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by mrblackbat » Mon Dec 22, 2008 11:37 am

doz_magic_man wrote:
ethiaa wrote:Hey, if BFS does something different I'll be delighted - maybe he learnt something at Newcastle. The fact he even tries to make them play like Bolton bodes ill. Stick with your rose coloured specs tho, everything will be fine.


Frankly, I'd rather grind out stacks of boring 1-0 victories and finish 5th than play free-flowing football and finish 7th. It's a results business first and foremost, attractive style of play second. I would say that 80% of Hughes's team performances were far from pleasing on the eye, although when things picked up he signalled his intention to play more attractive football.

I will be surprised if Allardyce gets the team playing as negatively as Bolton could play but I was a bit concerned when I read a comment saying something along the lines of; "we need to get 1-0 wins instead of winning by three clear goals". I hope he just meant that we need to be defensively water tight so that when we are in a tight match we don't concede and can hold on for a 1-0.
However, it's also an entertainment industry and so attractive football also has a very important place. You'd be happy with us finishing 5th playing grinding football; I'd be happy with us finishing 7th but playing more attractive football. Who's view is the correct one? Both and neither.

I don't think you're even close by saying 80% of Hughes' team performances were far from pleasing on the eye, either. Would be a much lower figure if you considered it objectively instead of to try and back up your argument.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by theadore » Mon Dec 22, 2008 1:01 pm

doz_magic_man wrote:Frankly, I'd rather grind out stacks of boring 1-0 victories and finish 5th than play free-flowing football and finish 7th. It's a results business first and foremost, attractive style of play second.
Don't quite understand this... if you'd have 10th I could understand your point a bit better.

For the club of course you have a point... they don't care if we're winning, but the same isn't true for a fan.

It comes down to whether you are a fan of Rovers first or football first I guess.... Personally I go with the latter... I follow rovers and want them to win, but I just like watching good football no matter who is playing and no matter who is winning. If you were more of a fan of rovers than football in general I guess you wouldn't care how we got the victories as long as we got them... having said that you probably wouldn't bother to pay to watch matches either... just check the league tables at the end of the season to see whether its been a good year or not.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by blackburn35 » Mon Dec 22, 2008 4:04 pm

Rover the Top wrote:
blackburn35 wrote:
bigpops wrote: it makes me want to :doh: cause u never say posative things
i agree with you most people on this board are super negative.
And blackburn35, you're the one who keeps suggesting everything should be done as it is in American sports. Now that's a very negative view... ;)
:D

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Dr Rover » Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:44 pm

Rover the Top wrote:...It was nice to win on Saturday, but anyone taking a balanced view will know that 3-0 flattered us.
I thought 3-0 flattered them... Really - they didnt work Robinson at all. I really only remembering him making one save.

On the other hand, I remember Roberts missing three one on ones, Pederson missing a good chance, McCarthy hitting the post, and Simonson making a superb double save.

I thought there was alot of scrambling the ball away in our final third - but what do you expect when the oppositions only tactic is to lump the ball into our box from anywhere.

That's not to say it was a perfect performance - it clearly wasnt. But it WAS 100 times better than the last heap of shite we saw. We even managed to play some good football in places, not much, but some.

For me, it was pretty much the perfect start for Fat Sam. Three goals scored, clean sheet, much better midfield pressing. It looked to me like he'd given the players a good kick up the arse. As if they all knew they were now playing for their places.

My one gripe was that Robinson STILL looks really really really really shakey on crosses.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by doz_magic_man » Mon Dec 22, 2008 10:25 pm

Rover the Top wrote:
doz_magic_man wrote:I'm glad that Sam has managed to shut the doubters up,
You're taking the piss, surely? Ince won his first game in charge, did that convince you that everything was going to be brilliant under him, too? It'll be ten games or so before anyone can say whether he stands a chance of keeping us up.


The warning signs were coming out of Ewood almost from day one with Ince. Talk of signing Fowler, talk of Friedel leaving, signing a League Two midfielder. The uninspiring television interviews simply added to the worries. 3-0 is far more convincing than 2-3.

I just have a really good feeling about Allardyce and I truly feel we are in safe hands again. I have agreed with everything I've heard him say to the media thus far and the players are talking about being organised again, getting back to basics etc. I'll stick my neck out and say that I will eat my hat if we are relegated under Allardyce's stewardship this season.

As I have said, I hope we do play attractive football but if we have to play ugly to beat the better sides and to get out of this mire then I'm all for it. I really cannot understand how you could defend the pile of shit that was Ince until very recently but then pick and snipe at Allardyce before he's even started. That's stubborn pedantry based on your own agendas.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:29 am

doz_magic_man wrote:I really cannot understand how you could defend the pile of shit that was Ince until very recently but then pick and snipe at Allardyce before he's even started.
Hmm, let me see - oh yes, it's called preference... people were picking and sniping at Ince before he started, perhaps you didn't notice because you were one of them? Allardyce was the last man I wanted to be given the job in the summer, and just because Ince turned out to be shite, that doesn't mean Fat Sam should suddenly be the automatic choice. I still don't like him as much as I didn't like him during the summer.

But, as with Ince, he'll get a chance to prove himself. His personality won't improve and he'll still be the former Bolton manager who was named in corruption investigations. But, he can do something about the football we play, and if it's enjoyable to sit in the Riverside every other Saturday, that's what matters. However, to claim he's proved people wrong after one game and just 3 days is sillier than the people who turned on Ince after the Sunderland defeat. As I said, it takes about ten games for the full effect of a change of manager to kick in.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by fitz808 » Tue Dec 23, 2008 8:41 am

surely it's perfectly justifiable to say you just don't like the man? i think even he would admit he is not someone the majority of people would like.
whilst we seem to be going round in circles on this point, i think it's worth re-itterating that there are a few of us on this board who will have a hard time liking allerdyce, but i think every single one of us is able to split that opinion about his personality and past behaviour from his performance in charge of rovers. i have no doubt that we will have a better chance of stayiung up with him in charge, and he certainly seems to have managed to get a better perfomance out of the players initially, so all is well. i can continue to dislike him as a person, whilst loving the fact that he is our new manager.

lets hope he can continue to build on this start (it's only one game, so lets hold off on the messiah talk just yet), and for us that also want to watch good football, let's hope he learns from the newcastle situation and allows the players to play with an element of flair. i think that will be an xmas prezzie we can all enjoy.

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by mrblackbat » Tue Dec 23, 2008 9:17 am

doz_magic_man wrote:
Rover the Top wrote:
doz_magic_man wrote:I'm glad that Sam has managed to shut the doubters up,
You're taking the piss, surely? Ince won his first game in charge, did that convince you that everything was going to be brilliant under him, too? It'll be ten games or so before anyone can say whether he stands a chance of keeping us up.


The warning signs were coming out of Ewood almost from day one with Ince. Talk of signing Fowler, talk of Friedel leaving, signing a League Two midfielder. The uninspiring television interviews simply added to the worries. 3-0 is far more convincing than 2-3.

I just have a really good feeling about Allardyce and I truly feel we are in safe hands again. I have agreed with everything I've heard him say to the media thus far and the players are talking about being organised again, getting back to basics etc. I'll stick my neck out and say that I will eat my hat if we are relegated under Allardyce's stewardship this season.

As I have said, I hope we do play attractive football but if we have to play ugly to beat the better sides and to get out of this mire then I'm all for it. I really cannot understand how you could defend the pile of shit that was Ince until very recently but then pick and snipe at Allardyce before he's even started. That's stubborn pedantry based on your own agendas.
Pot, kettle? ;)

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by doz_magic_man » Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:24 pm

Rover the Top wrote:Hmm, let me see - oh yes, it's called preference... [people were picking and sniping at Ince before he started, perhaps you didn't notice because you were one of them? Allardyce was the last man I wanted to be given the job in the summer, and just because Ince turned out to be shite, that doesn't mean Fat Sam should suddenly be the automatic choice. I still don't like him as much as I didn't like him during the summer.


I've said on numerous occasions that I backed Ince at the beginning and wanted him to prove the media wrong etc. I even felt he could "do a Hughes". He wasn't my number one choice but I backed him when he took over.

I know Allardyce has history but part of that history is proven team organisation and making sides difficult to beat. Now he is our manager it's time to swallow negative opinions for the time being until he's shown us what he can do. You wanted Curbishley, I wanted Allardyce. We got Allardyce, deal with it. Can you seriously say you would have preferred Souness?

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Re: Rovers vs Stoke

Post by doz_magic_man » Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:29 pm

mrblackbat wrote:Pot, kettle? ;)


I'm stubborn yes, but there is only one King of playing Devil's Advocate on this board and that's coming from a guy who's paid to do it (a lawyer). I must say I do enjoy coming on this board for a good old debate when I have the time!

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