England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

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Joe
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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Joe » Tue Jun 01, 2010 9:48 am

mrblackbat wrote:
Joe wrote:
Joe wrote:I like the idea of playing both Walcott and Lennon. Hopefully we'll see a different approach to the game this time.

I do hope Joe Cole gets a chance to impress though.
The static, dire, unimaginative first half meant that neither Walcott or Lennon were given the chance to impress.

I was glad Joe Cole played well though. That should cement his place on the plane.

Hopefully Heskey and Bent did enough to warrant NOT being included in the last 23.
That's the glass half full way of looking at it. My view would be that Walcott saw a lot of the ball and did precisely nothing with it; exemplified when he and Johnson had a perfect overlap going, for them both to try and shirk all responsibilty and once again fail to get a cross in.

So, if you're not going to take Bent or Heskey (I agree on the latter, and feel very sorry for Bent who simply doesn't get the chances he deserves), who are you going to take up front?
Our chances rest on Rooney staying fit. If he gets injured, then we're screwed no matter who we have taken as back-up. So I'd only bring Rooney, Crouch and Defoe as strikers. Bent's first touch and general all round game isn't good enough for international football.

We can take an extra one of the wingers this way, who I think will be more important in complimenting Rooney. We have multiple players who can fill the role of playing off Rooney if Gerrard was to get injured.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by mrblackbat » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:14 am

Joe wrote:
mrblackbat wrote:
Joe wrote:
Joe wrote:I like the idea of playing both Walcott and Lennon. Hopefully we'll see a different approach to the game this time.

I do hope Joe Cole gets a chance to impress though.
The static, dire, unimaginative first half meant that neither Walcott or Lennon were given the chance to impress.

I was glad Joe Cole played well though. That should cement his place on the plane.

Hopefully Heskey and Bent did enough to warrant NOT being included in the last 23.
That's the glass half full way of looking at it. My view would be that Walcott saw a lot of the ball and did precisely nothing with it; exemplified when he and Johnson had a perfect overlap going, for them both to try and shirk all responsibilty and once again fail to get a cross in.

So, if you're not going to take Bent or Heskey (I agree on the latter, and feel very sorry for Bent who simply doesn't get the chances he deserves), who are you going to take up front?
Our chances rest on Rooney staying fit. If he gets injured, then we're screwed no matter who we have taken as back-up. So I'd only bring Rooney, Crouch and Defoe as strikers. Bent's first touch and general all round game isn't good enough for international football.

We can take an extra one of the wingers this way, who I think will be more important in complimenting Rooney. We have multiple players who can fill the role of playing off Rooney if Gerrard was to get injured.
You can't just completely give up hope should Rooney not be fit though. :roll: I'd have personally liked to have seen Rooney not play at all, and try Crouch/Defoe and Defoe/Bent up front.

If anything, the game against Japan showed that the wingers really didn't work; Walcott was hopeless and in the first half Lennon was more interested in letting Cashley wander wherever he felt like - together they provided absolutely no service whatsoever to the front men and coupled with a slow and labouring Huddlestone in midfield contributed to making us dreadful. You complain about the first half being static, and if anything that was because our wingers were rubbish.

Things livened up a bit when Lennon was moved to his natural side, and with more mobility in midfield; only for Capello to change things and bring the useless lump on up front.

It was nice to see Gerrard holding deeper more often whilst alongside Lampard too.

In terms of squad I'd be picking:-

GK - Hart, Green, James

D - Johnson, Terry, Ferdinand, A Cole, Baines, Upson, Carragher, Dawson

M - Lennon, Gerrard, Lampard, Milner, J Cole, Barry (if fit), Wright-Phillips, Carrick (even though he's been shit, better than the other options)

A - Rooney, Crouch, Defoe, Bent
Last edited by mrblackbat on Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Savory » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:15 am

Take bent, cos if rooney gets injured, we havent got a better striker to play alone up front instead.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Joe » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:23 am

mrblackbat wrote:
You can't just completely give up hope should Rooney not be fit though. :roll: I'd have personally liked to have seen Rooney not play at all, and try Crouch/Defoe and Defoe/Bent up front.

If anything, the game against Japan showed that the wingers really didn't work; Walcott was hopeless and in the first half Lennon was more interested in letting Cashley wander wherever he felt like - together they provided absolutely no service whatsoever to the front men and coupled with a slow and labouring Huddlestone in midfield contributed to making us dreadful.

Things livened up a bit when Lennon was moved to his natural side, and with more mobility in midfield; only for Capello to change things and bring the useless lump on up front.

It was nice to see Gerrard holding deeper more often whilst alongside Lampard too.
Can't I?

If Rooney gets injured, we have much chance of winning the world cup as winning the next African Cup of Nations.

I'm pretty sure Capello's favoured 11 will include Gerrard playing off Rooney, which will leave the wingers playing more as inside forwards than wingers in a 442 system.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:25 am

Joe wrote:If Rooney gets injured, we have much chance of winning the world cup as winning the next African Cup of Nations.
So, about the same chance as if he doesn't get injured...

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Joe » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:29 am

Rover the Top wrote:
Joe wrote:If Rooney gets injured, we have much chance of winning the world cup as winning the next African Cup of Nations.
So, about the same chance as if he doesn't get injured...
No. I think we have a slim outside chance of winning it should he stay fit. Although I admit, it would be a huge ask.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by roverzealous » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:33 am

mrblackbat wrote: GK - Hart, Green, James

D - Johnson, Terry, Ferdinand, A Cole, Baines, Upson, Carragher, Dawson

M - Lennon, Gerrard, Lampard, Milner, J Cole, Barry (if fit), Wright-Phillips, Carrick (even though he's been shit, better than the other options)

A - Rooney, Crouch, Defoe, Bent
I think mine would be the exactly the same as this, shame about Walcott though.

If Rooney gets injured then I'd go with Crouch and Defoe, they're used to playing together for Spurs and both have been scoring for England.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:33 am

There's bound to be a penalty shoot out at some point, and then we are fucked.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by roverzealous » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:35 am

Yep.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by mrblackbat » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:36 am

Joe wrote:
mrblackbat wrote:
You can't just completely give up hope should Rooney not be fit though. :roll: I'd have personally liked to have seen Rooney not play at all, and try Crouch/Defoe and Defoe/Bent up front.

If anything, the game against Japan showed that the wingers really didn't work; Walcott was hopeless and in the first half Lennon was more interested in letting Cashley wander wherever he felt like - together they provided absolutely no service whatsoever to the front men and coupled with a slow and labouring Huddlestone in midfield contributed to making us dreadful.

Things livened up a bit when Lennon was moved to his natural side, and with more mobility in midfield; only for Capello to change things and bring the useless lump on up front.

It was nice to see Gerrard holding deeper more often whilst alongside Lampard too.
Can't I?

If Rooney gets injured, we have much chance of winning the world cup as winning the next African Cup of Nations.

I'm pretty sure Capello's favoured 11 will include Gerrard playing off Rooney, which will leave the wingers playing more as inside forwards than wingers in a 442 system.
Well you can, but it's a rather sad thing to do. I think we're far too reliant on Rooney. Whilst he should be the focus of the team, we still have more than enough quality players to win games against great sides without him on the pitch.

Even in a 4-5-1 system, I still think that Walcott just isn't plain good enough. I also think that with Barry looking more and more likely to be unfit, that Gerrard will be playing in a traditional centre midfield role alongside Lampard. It worked fine against Japan in both systems. That'd leave room for Cole to sit behind Rooney, or Rooney to sit behind Crouch depending on how you prefer it; with, for me, Lennon on the right and Milner on the left.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by mrblackbat » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:37 am

roverzealous wrote:
mrblackbat wrote: GK - Hart, Green, James

D - Johnson, Terry, Ferdinand, A Cole, Baines, Upson, Carragher, Dawson

M - Lennon, Gerrard, Lampard, Milner, J Cole, Barry (if fit), Wright-Phillips, Carrick (even though he's been shit, better than the other options)

A - Rooney, Crouch, Defoe, Bent
I think mine would be the exactly the same as this, shame about Walcott though.

If Rooney gets injured then I'd go with Crouch and Defoe, they're used to playing together for Spurs and both have been scoring for England.
It is a shame about Walcott, because he should be a great player. But he isn't. Plus, he dives too much, thanks Arsene.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by roverzealous » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:45 am

Against the US:
------------------ROONEY------------------
------------------J.COLE-------------------
MILNER--GERRARD-LAMPARD--LENNON
A.COLE--FERDINAND-TERRY--JOHNSON
-------------------HART--------------------

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by mrblackbat » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:48 am

roverzealous wrote:Against the US:
------------------ROONEY------------------
------------------J.COLE-------------------
MILNER--GERRARD-LAMPARD--LENNON
A.COLE--FERDINAND-TERRY--JOHNSON
-------------------HART--------------------
Yup I'd go with that. The only change could be J Cole for Crouch, in my opinion.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Savory » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:48 am

Against the US:
------------------ROONEY------------------
------------------GERRARD-------------------
J.COLE--BARRY-LAMPARD--LENNON
A.COLE--FERDINAND-TERRY--CARRAGHER
-------------------HART--------------------

i'd put a bet on glen johnson costing us a victory or two, he just cant defend.

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Re: England v Japan, 30/05/2010, 13:15

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Jun 01, 2010 10:51 am

From the BBC live text wrote:"Emile Heskey, striker, 58 caps 7 goals. Rene Higuita, keeper, 68 caps 8 goals. Jose Luis Chilavert, keeper, 74 caps 8 goals..."
:rofl:

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On the team for the opening game: I think it would be madness to leave Peter Crouch out. He might not be one of the glamour names in the squad, and he's not the most gifted player either. But he does the job of converting the chances other players create better than anyone else.

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