England Squad

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mrblackbat
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Re: England Squad

Post by mrblackbat » Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:51 pm

We're going to win the World Cup cause Rooney isn't there!!!! :hyper:

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Re: England Squad

Post by Gibbon » Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:13 pm

Rover the Top wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:29 pm
Although the one downside to winning 6-1 is that some are getting carried away.
Against Panama ffs! :lol:

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Rover the Top
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Re: England Squad

Post by Rover the Top » Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:51 pm

mrblackbat wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 1:51 pm
We're going to win the World Cup cause Rooney isn't there!!!! :hyper:
:lol:

Sterling seems to have taken on the role of being the one to hate on anyway. :shrug:
There was an obvious problem with balance to the side when successive managers tried to fit both Gerrard and Lampard into the line up, but other than that England's main issue has been the dreary, over cautious tactics. This current group have been allowed to play with freedom and enjoy international games. Panama were there to batter in that first half and the manager let the team get on with it instead of trying to shut down the game at 2-0. I don't think Hart and Rooney would get selected on their form over the last year. But had they had better seasons, they could easily be part of what is a more positive team.

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Re: England Squad

Post by mrblackbat » Mon Jun 25, 2018 3:04 pm

Is that cause Sterling is one of the most infuriating players to watch ever?

*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, does something magical and we score*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*
*Sterling gets ball, runs into nearest man*

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Rover the Top
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Re: England Squad

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Jun 26, 2018 8:40 am

Looks like the Portugal v Iran farce has really stirred up some anti VAR sentiment.

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Re: England Squad

Post by Dan » Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:30 am

VAR isn't the problem, it's still the referees making mistakes whether they're making them on their own or with the help of a replay. People seem to be blaming VAR as if it's some form of technology going wrong, and need to understand that it is only a TV replay, the same replays we've been watching for years at home and that get hours of analysis by presenters and pundits. The replays are now available to referees during a game to correct mistakes, that's not a bad thing. The lack of consistency with the refereeing is the issue, some are being incredibly picky and some are letting things slide. These are supposed to be the best referees in the world, but having said that, the difference in standards and practices across the world will be huge. European referees, for example, will have been used to looking for different things than Asian referees. It's inevitable, the game is slightly different in every country, but at this level there had to be more consistency.

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Re: England Squad

Post by Rover the Top » Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:03 am

Dan wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:30 am
VAR isn't the problem, it's still the referees making mistakes whether they're making them on their own or with the help of a replay. People seem to be blaming VAR as if it's some form of technology going wrong, and need to understand that it is only a TV replay, the same replays we've been watching for years at home and that get hours of analysis by presenters and pundits. The replays are now available to referees during a game to correct mistakes, that's not a bad thing.
It is a bad thing if they make the "right" decision initially, but then somehow see the incident differently on replay and give the "wrong" decision. Out of interest, what percentage of VAR checks have resulted in the ref sticking with his original decision? (I think I've only seen one).The offside checks are fine apart from they don't correct play being wrongly stopped and preventing a goalscoring chance. But I think it's now 3 handballs given for cases of ball-to-hand, plus several incidents where the replay hasn't been reviewed for clear fouls. Then there's the review for a red card for Ronaldo that seems to split opinion even after watching the footage several times. VAR isn't just adding the cameras, it's the whole system and it's creating as much controversy as it is correcting mistakes. Maybe as in other sports it will get better over time. But if we all take the attitude that it's not the problem and brush the criticism away because the idea is a good thing, it won't improve.

For me, the system isn't working as well as it could because they're going back to the ref to mark his own work. I'm not sure if that happens in any other sport - obviously tennis umpires can't overrule Hawkeye and cricket umpires follow the instruction of the third umpire. I'm a bit hazy on what happens in rugby but I think the ref asks whoever is watching the video to look for something rather than reviews the footage himself. Maybe NFL is different? In football, the ref accepts the call of the linesman, why can't they accept the call of the video ref?

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Re: England Squad

Post by mcteeth » Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:05 pm

VAR showing how important it can be today.

Germany out :hyper:

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Re: England Squad

Post by mrblackbat » Wed Jun 27, 2018 5:12 pm

There were. Couple of good VAR decisions today, though I still agree with RTT that there's no need for the referee to review them; though in the case of the alleged Hernandez handball not going with the referral was correct.

And..... Germany.... Hehe.

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Re: England Squad

Post by Rover the Top » Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:45 am

I thought the Hernandez one was the first review that actually was a handball - he had time to see the ball coming towards him and twisted his body so that the ball hit his arm. Didn't matter in the end but that's not the point. Offsides are easy to correct because there's a strict rule to follow, the only issue will be when an onside striker is incorrectly pulled back before they put the ball in the goal. However, I think the process they're going through to handle the more subjective decisions is problematic. And it's obvious why it won't work, why it will create more controversy. I struggle to understand the resistance to improve on it.

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Re: England Squad

Post by Ethiaa » Thu Jun 28, 2018 9:06 am

Perhaps they need to consider referee's call - if it's a matter of opinion just go with the initial decision. At the moment it is simply highlighting the poor judgement many referees have even with the benefit of replays (and an apparent total lack of understanding of the handball rule although that's no shock - most fans and players don't seem to understand it either).

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Re: England Squad

Post by mrblackbat » Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:34 pm

Rover the Top wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:45 am
I thought the Hernandez one was the first review that actually was a handball - he had time to see the ball coming towards him and twisted his body so that the ball hit his arm. Didn't matter in the end but that's not the point. Offsides are easy to correct because there's a strict rule to follow, the only issue will be when an onside striker is incorrectly pulled back before they put the ball in the goal. However, I think the process they're going through to handle the more subjective decisions is problematic. And it's obvious why it won't work, why it will create more controversy. I struggle to understand the resistance to improve on it.
But one of the angles clearly shows the ball didn't roll on his arm at all?

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Re: England Squad

Post by Rover the Top » Thu Jun 28, 2018 1:33 pm

mrblackbat wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 12:34 pm
Rover the Top wrote:
Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:45 am
I thought the Hernandez one was the first review that actually was a handball - he had time to see the ball coming towards him and twisted his body so that the ball hit his arm. Didn't matter in the end but that's not the point. Offsides are easy to correct because there's a strict rule to follow, the only issue will be when an onside striker is incorrectly pulled back before they put the ball in the goal. However, I think the process they're going through to handle the more subjective decisions is problematic. And it's obvious why it won't work, why it will create more controversy. I struggle to understand the resistance to improve on it.
But one of the angles clearly shows the ball didn't roll on his arm at all?
:shock: I... don't see how you come to that conclusion. The direction the ball bounces away from him indicates it came off his arm. I haven't seen an angle that suggests otherwise. But maybe that's the ultimate problem, even with video replays people can have different verdicts.

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Re: England Squad

Post by mrblackbat » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:53 pm

The angle from the left shows the ball hit his chest and only move forwards from that point on; there's an optical illusion on the angle from the front where it appears to roll on his arm, but if you look from the left and the position of his right arm which is held behind his chest, it's impossible for it to have made contact.

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Re: England Squad

Post by ReallyRelievedRover » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:06 am

This is pretty interesting, not quite sure how accurate it is and certainly have no idea how players are valued anymore. Rashford the 4th most expensive England player at the World Cup. Kane 3rd most valuable of any player? Aguero looks a little cheap compared to some of the other 'world class' 'superstars' having a kickabout in Russia this summer.

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/wm-2018 ... ewerb/WM18

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